Mr. Yamane, weren't you young...
when you saw "Battles Without Honor and Humanity"?
I saw it as a youth.
I identified with the youth on the screen.
And I wasn't thinking of the age of the director.
I always saw my involvement and the character's involvement...
in youth as the same.
Of course in "Battle Royale,"
I don't see it that way.
But I completely understood how today's youth see it that way.
And as you said, Kinji Fukasaku...
was always making youth movies.
And that is correct.
Movies should identify with youth.
At a basic level. At the core.
Not to take away from movies about seniors.
I think Kenta might agree, from a producer's perspective, Director Fukasaku...
has a strong sense of curiosity,
both as a writer and as a human.
This may sound strange... and it's changed over time...
but when he was young and in his prime,
he was interested in anything we brought to him.
We had the impression that he'd go for anything.
Of course, as we proceed, things come up...
that he can and cannot do, and things are selected.
But we always admired...
his writing ability and curiosity.
So those who see Kinji Fukasaku...
as a certain type of director...
have a narrow view.
When I interviewed him for my book,
I was impressed...
that he did the "Battles" series...
through the '70s.
Then in the '80s and after... a twenty year period...
many producers approached him...
to do a movie like "Battles Without Honor and Humanity."
But he would say that was that, and it's over.
He wants to go to the next place. That next place...
is once again about young people wriggling around.
But he won't repeat "Battles Without Honor and Humanity."
Instead, he keeps his curiosity piqued...
and waits for a producer to bring something interesting.
"Battles," the yakuza movie, is just one side of Kinji Fukasaku.
He also did period movies, science fiction,
action, all sorts of genres.
But when he did "Battles,"
I didn't understand yakuza movies.
So I asked him how he felt when he shot it.
He said, "Frankly, I don't understand yakuza either."
He said he wanted to speak to...
his anger as a youth, and to terrorist militancy.
That was his approach.
That may have been his approach toward "Battles."
In his movies, he was good at merging himself into the work.
It's required of an artist.
In "Battles," Toei finally found a good yakuza story,
had Fukasaku direct, and it succeeded.
But it left the domain...
of the yakuza genre and dwelled...
on the postwar feelings of the youth.
And I think that's why young people enjoy "Battles" today.
I think it's Fukasaku's youth energy...
that allowed it to go past...
the yakuza genre.
I wasn't involved in "Battles" so I don't know,
but reading the interview by Mr. Yamane,
he was very sensitive toward change...
and was curious.
Well, that opinion is, well... Director Fukasaku is...
I want to ask Mr. Sato and Kenta about movie directors.
What do the current times...
require of movies?
For example, in the '80s,
most of the movie audiences were women.
So what does the female audience want to see?
So Director Fukasaku might not want...
to do a movie for women,
but he still thinks about what he can do in that context.
Then Producer Masao Sato brings him "House on Fire."
A story that might attract the female audience.
He incorporates his own family matters.
He is extremely sensitive toward social trends in that way.
He grabs the crossing point...
between that and his curiosity.
When Mr. Sato brings him many projects, he's curious about all of it,
but often ultimately rejects them, right?
Yes. For example in the series "Yakuza Wives,"
he always reads the scripts.
He says let me think about it.
Ultimately, he says he can't do it and rejects it.
In that sense, he is highly curious.
And as Mr. Yamane says, Fukasaku is highly attuned...
and considerate about social changes.
But for us people on the set, for example in "House on Fire,"
we say it's for women after the fact,
and as a producer, I'm going for that.
But for us on the set, as Kenta said,
it seems like the old man is basing it on himself.
Those feelings are strong. And in fact, he does project a lot of himself into that movie.
I'm not sure how much he's aware of the female audience...
when he's in production.
Does the producer think...
most about budgetary implications?
Or casting matters?
Is he picky about those things?
Well, all directors have issues...
about budget, style, and tastes.
Those things don't pertain to just Mr. Fukasaku.
But he sure enjoys being on the set.
He enjoys it so he keeps on shooting.
So, as a producer I worry about making the release date.
At the time, Japanese movies based their schedule on the release date.
If we don't make the release date, the theaters end up projecting white.
That is the number one responsibility for a producer.
And every time Kinji Fukasaku is director, I worry about finishing it.
Well, all sorts of things happen.
He is so happy on the set and others pick up on that.
But when that continues for six months,
frankly, everyone else is exhausted.
We say, "I'll never follow him again."
But when we see the results,
we see our sweat and effort embedded on the screen.
With that joy, and after six months, we want to work with Fukasaku again.
That's the kind of director he is.
Even in "Battles Without Honor and Humanity," as Producer Sato said,
they shoot during the day, eat dinner at dusk, and shoot at night.
And it's sensible to finish around 10:00 pm,
but it goes on late into the night.
So Fukasaku becomes known...
as the "late night work group."
The shoot goes on until it's 3:00 am or 4:00 am.
Then they have a drink and go to sleep.
Then they start again at 9:00 am.
The actors are exhausted, but unbelievably...
the director is full of pep and totally energized.
According to the director, the actors lack sleep,
are hung over, and their eyes are bloodshot.
But it's "Battles," so this effect...
is more forceful and appropriate.
He is a person that ties everything into the work.
He has a habit of saying...
When it's past midnight, Production worries...
about the next day's shooting order and meals.
When it passes midnight, Director Fukasaku has the habit of saying,
"We're having so much fun now. Why stop? Let's do a little more."
I think, "This is bad."
Then it's morning the next day.
So I'm prepping the set until the next morning,
leaving about 9:00 am.
So I cross paths with other normal crews...
coming in the morning and it feels miserable.
But Director Fukasaku enjoyed it.
- He really likes it. - He really liked it.
That's why he never came home. I can't believe I followed the same path.
The one time I followed him as an assistant director on a movie...
we finished at 5:00 am, and we're to start at 9:00 am.
But rather than go home, we start drinking.
We'd start drinking from 5:00 am to 8:00 am, rest an hour, then go on location.
I was amazed by his stamina.
What movie was it...
that the meal budget shot up...
to hundreds of thousands?
When the Fukasaku group shot on the Kyoto lot,
the taxi and meal companies loved us.
I was always asked by them, "When is the Fukasaku group coming again?"
On the set, the actors and crew are good.
Even in hardship, it's a celebration.
The same can be said about the creating of the scenario.
It doesn't involve many people.
You are alone in a smoke-filled single room.
This can be hardship.
After two or three months,
you want to give up.
But he doesn't give up.
He had a lot of energy.
The movie was green-lighted,
when Producer Koji Shundo wanted Kinji Fukasaku,
The writer disagreed...
and there was considerable trouble.
A long time before that,
Kasahara wrote a scenario for Fukasaku.
He didn't like it, they had a huge fight, and fixed it together.
After they fixed it, Director Fukasaku fell ill...
and left the project.
Kasahara remembered the fights...
and has written, "Normally, Kinji Fukasaku...
is, unbelievably, the nicest person...
in the world,
but when it comes to work,
he's so scary...
that even the devil avoids him."
At the time,
there was Fukasaku in Tokyo...
and Taii Kato of Kyoto.
Both were of the same fashion.
Even the devil avoids them.
Nobody is so bothersome on the set.
So he thought "Battles Without Honor and Humanity"...
would be rewritten, and said, "No!"
Director Fukasaku read it, and it must have struck a chord; because he said,
"I will not change one line. I will shoot it as is." So,
green light.
We don't know what goes on inside the mind of Director Fukasaku,
but he does have those things we discussed:
his images of youth and thoughts he carries and writes about.
And in his movies, there are his aesthetics, his vitality, his interest.
No matter how great the theme,
his natural born need as a director to make the picture interesting and vivid...
is the same with all his work.
So when it came to the writings of others,
he had his own take on things.
He has his own take on things,
so he has to write about it.
But that alone isn't good enough.
It isn't that "Battle Royale" is about youngsters,
so have a youngster like Kenta write it,
but also in other projects,
he collaborates with other writers.
What I understood from talking with Mr. Fukasaku...
is that he has a lot of his own things,
yet he can delegate.
In a funny way, he seeks to squeeze out all of a persons talent.
- There seems to be a lot of that. - Yes, there is.
As a director and a human, he has this big bag.
And I try to challenge him, only to realize I've been put into this bag.
And I find this bag is strangely comfortable... an enjoyable bag.
That's why members of the Fukasaku group...
don't want to follow him after a production,
but after a short while, we miss it and want to work with him again.
So, ultimately, he was an enjoyable director and it was an enjoyable set.
As Mr. Yamane said,
a Fukasaku movie has a consistent trait.
Many directors of this caliber exhibit patterns...
of collaborations with actors and DPs.
But Director Fukasaku doesn't exhibit any particular patterns...
of collaboration with writers.
Mr. Kounabe often wrote for him,
but I think it was hard for writers...
to work with Mr. Fukasaku.
So each time, things were shaped differently.
So I think it was a big deal that Kenta took on the hardship...
of taking on his last two movies.
I think the best match was Mr. Kasahara,
who wrote "Battles Without Honor and Humanity."
But the number of pictures he did with Mr. Kasahara are very few.
There were the four "Battles" movies and "Cops vs. Thugs."
And "Yakuza Graveyard." That's all.
- That's all, right? - Yes.
So it was strange, but Mr. Kasahara died...
2 or 3 weeks before my father died.
My father got the news during the rehearsals for "Battle Royale II."
A book had just come out about Mr. Kasahara.
My father was suffering from cancer.
He couldn't read. He couldn't even read his own script.
But in one night, he went through the entire thick book,
and even highlighted everything about himself.
And that was the last book...
that Kinji Fukasaku ever read.
- It was a strange twist of fate. - Yes.
Mr. Kasahara and Mr. Fukasaku were artists of the same era.
They battled and respected each other.
But they weren't in the same group.
They built their own thing and didn't do too many collaborations.
That's what I think.
The inner sleeve...
of the book on Kasahara...
has some comments written by Fukasaku.
I don't think Director Fukasaku...
was expecting to die one month later.
In the book on Mr. Kasahara,
he writes, "Comrade," as though they were...
two comrades who came up fighting...
through the postwar era.
In terms of comrades, there were actors too.
Starting, in his debut, with Sonny Chiba...
at his prime in meeting Bunta Sugawaru...
and many actresses and the youngsters of "Battle Royale."
He kept on changing and enjoying new partners.
And he kept on challenging all sorts of people.
Doing that over 60 movies with so many people...
in all the genres was his attractiveness.
But I think the most compatible...
was Sonny Chiba and Bunta Sugawaru.
This is another strange twist of fate:
30 minutes before passing away,
Bunta Sugawaru came rushing into the hospital room...
and held his hand during his last breath.
Mother and I, Bunta and many of the crew saw him off.
He was probably happy that his movie life...
was with him to the end.
And probably happy as a father.